As a person with relatively undeveloped thoughts and feelings on foreign policy and our role in world peace, I found this post to be accessible and thought provoking. I had the inclination to "start with [you] about the sin's of America's past", but some of the last few sentences about trying to improve as a country instead of giving up and leaving other countries to rot was very convincing.
As a person that wants to be more informed and have all things considered(1), I would have appreciated more concessions or at least more in depth explanations of Biden's (or others') reasons for not having war on the table. What reasons are there? Any that you see as more valid than others?
Also - steps going forward? Can the US put war back on the table?
I’ll be honest, I haven’t given much thought to the other side because it seems like such a ridiculous place to start from in a diplomatic negotiation. However, the argument you hear is something along the lines of “so much blood and treasure has been spilt in misguided wars.” And I’ll concede that this is true, As I think I do in my post. For example, I think the war in Iraq was probably a mistake (I’m not quite willing to concede this point because I think things looked and felt different at the time, in the aftermath of 9/11 (which doesn’t really mean anything - the fact is, there wasn’t a reason to go to war (so I guess the reason I’m unwilling to completely concede this point is pride))); as much as Sadam was a bad man, as far as I know, we had no indications of genocide from within the country and the “intelligence” about WMDs turned out to be basically made up. So we toppled a government and created a power vacuum that helped lead to the rise of Isis for nothing.
And a lot of blood and a lot of treasure was spilt there. The same could be said for other conflicts the United States has gotten involved in. Again, not a history buff, so I don’t know the specifics of the conflicts in Korea and Vietnam, but people refer to them as though they were similar to Iraq and Afghanistan i.e. the United States getting involved in what was essentially an internal struggle. Then again, in hindsight, wouldn’t the world be a better place if we hadn’t signed an armistice with North Korea and the Kim family wasn’t subjugating millions of people? And we have to point out that the issue in Afghanistan was mission creep not the war itself, we went in because we were attacked and we needed to root out the problem, which is completely justified. The issue was that we began nation building and imposing our will on another country.
Anyway, that’s a lot of rambling to say: I think those in the anti-war camp have plenty of reason to be skeptical of war. The United States has a tendency to bite off more than it can chew. I just don’t think that’s a smart position to take across the board. We have to remember that the United States also won two world wars, freed Kuwait in the 90s, and while we didn’t win the Korean war, South Koreans basically exist in a free society because of American intervention. There’s a reason the post war era is referred to as the Pax-Americana.
Steps moving forward. I think at this stage, it’s too late to put war back on the table. Putin has basically threatened nuclear war if we do, and I think we can take him at his word. But if it were me, I’d do everything short of sending troops into Ukraine to stop the Russian advance. That would include selling and giving away weaponry, providing intelligence to Ukraine, aiding them in their cyber warfare, and sanctioning literally all of Russia (maybe not all of Russia, but I would make more than just the elites hurt). President Biden should be rallying Americans around the Ukrainian cause so that if Putin decides to move beyond Ukraine, the will of the United States is behind the cause. Because when America is united, I do not think there’s a power on earth that stands a chance, unfortunately we’re more divided than ever and elites are (stupidly) discussing whether there will be another civil war.
2 days later...Yeah I think I'm generally on the same page - do everything we can to keep protect Ukraine and other countries from Russia and China short of provoking nuclear war.
As a person with relatively undeveloped thoughts and feelings on foreign policy and our role in world peace, I found this post to be accessible and thought provoking. I had the inclination to "start with [you] about the sin's of America's past", but some of the last few sentences about trying to improve as a country instead of giving up and leaving other countries to rot was very convincing.
As a person that wants to be more informed and have all things considered(1), I would have appreciated more concessions or at least more in depth explanations of Biden's (or others') reasons for not having war on the table. What reasons are there? Any that you see as more valid than others?
Also - steps going forward? Can the US put war back on the table?
(1) - Not the podcast
I’ll be honest, I haven’t given much thought to the other side because it seems like such a ridiculous place to start from in a diplomatic negotiation. However, the argument you hear is something along the lines of “so much blood and treasure has been spilt in misguided wars.” And I’ll concede that this is true, As I think I do in my post. For example, I think the war in Iraq was probably a mistake (I’m not quite willing to concede this point because I think things looked and felt different at the time, in the aftermath of 9/11 (which doesn’t really mean anything - the fact is, there wasn’t a reason to go to war (so I guess the reason I’m unwilling to completely concede this point is pride))); as much as Sadam was a bad man, as far as I know, we had no indications of genocide from within the country and the “intelligence” about WMDs turned out to be basically made up. So we toppled a government and created a power vacuum that helped lead to the rise of Isis for nothing.
And a lot of blood and a lot of treasure was spilt there. The same could be said for other conflicts the United States has gotten involved in. Again, not a history buff, so I don’t know the specifics of the conflicts in Korea and Vietnam, but people refer to them as though they were similar to Iraq and Afghanistan i.e. the United States getting involved in what was essentially an internal struggle. Then again, in hindsight, wouldn’t the world be a better place if we hadn’t signed an armistice with North Korea and the Kim family wasn’t subjugating millions of people? And we have to point out that the issue in Afghanistan was mission creep not the war itself, we went in because we were attacked and we needed to root out the problem, which is completely justified. The issue was that we began nation building and imposing our will on another country.
Anyway, that’s a lot of rambling to say: I think those in the anti-war camp have plenty of reason to be skeptical of war. The United States has a tendency to bite off more than it can chew. I just don’t think that’s a smart position to take across the board. We have to remember that the United States also won two world wars, freed Kuwait in the 90s, and while we didn’t win the Korean war, South Koreans basically exist in a free society because of American intervention. There’s a reason the post war era is referred to as the Pax-Americana.
Steps moving forward. I think at this stage, it’s too late to put war back on the table. Putin has basically threatened nuclear war if we do, and I think we can take him at his word. But if it were me, I’d do everything short of sending troops into Ukraine to stop the Russian advance. That would include selling and giving away weaponry, providing intelligence to Ukraine, aiding them in their cyber warfare, and sanctioning literally all of Russia (maybe not all of Russia, but I would make more than just the elites hurt). President Biden should be rallying Americans around the Ukrainian cause so that if Putin decides to move beyond Ukraine, the will of the United States is behind the cause. Because when America is united, I do not think there’s a power on earth that stands a chance, unfortunately we’re more divided than ever and elites are (stupidly) discussing whether there will be another civil war.
What are your thoughts?
2 days later...Yeah I think I'm generally on the same page - do everything we can to keep protect Ukraine and other countries from Russia and China short of provoking nuclear war.